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Forum Home > Expose AA Bash Board > Alcoholics Anonymous (AA): The AA Wall of Shame

Live_free_or_die
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The Alcoholics Anonymous Wall of Shame

 

 

Persons inducted onto The Wall of Shame are those persons who by their actions or inactions, allow for the continued varied abuses by AA/12 Step programs of the individual in need of real support and help.

 

Bill Wilson

Born in Vermont in 1895, William Griffith Wilson (Bill W.) was considered a co-founder of AA when in fact all Bill W. did was incorporate some previous religious movements into his brain-less child.

 

Bob Smith

Robert Holbrook Smith (Dr. Bob) was a proctologist that lived in Ohio.

 

Lois Wilson

George Vaillant

E. Morton Jellinek

The General Service Board of Alcoholics Anonymous, Inc.

Alcoholics Anonymous World Services, Inc.

Alcoholics Anonymous Grapevine, Inc.

Hazelden Foundation

The Stepping Stones Foundation

Marty Mann

Francis Hartigan

Susan Cheever

The US Court System

The state court systems

Parole/Probation offices and staff

The states departments of corrections

The 12 Step treatment centers

The U.S insurance industry

Clancy Imislund

Michael Quinones

Dr. Drew

Dr. Dave and Bill (NY Daily News)

Ann Landers

Gabor Mate – Greatest disappointment

Patrick Kennedy

The Parity Act

Dr. Phil

Jim B

Lance G

Dr. Silkworthless

Dr. Harry Tiebout

Frank Nathan Daniel Buchman

Sam Shoemaker

Up With People

Peter Howard

Moral Re-Armament

Aldous Huxley

Helen Wynn

Richmond Walker - author

BBC - British Broadcasting Corporation

Chris Raymer >> http://www.originsrecovery.com/our-staff/chris-raymer/

Mel B. (Mel Barger)

 

Ernest Kurtz

The most complete history of A.A. ever written. Not God contains anecdotes and excerpts from the diaries, correspondence, and occasional memoirs of A.A.'s early figures. A fascinating, fast-moving, and authoritative account of the discovery and development of the program and fellowship that we know today as Alcoholics Anonymous.

 

God®

 

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Pro Empowerment - Engage & Enable


November 27, 2012 at 10:42 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Starmom
Member
Posts: 319

not sure exactly how to word this, but would you say there is or was an actual connection between AA and NA?  

November 27, 2012 at 10:49 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Live_free_or_die
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Posts: 849

I really don't know anything about NA other than it was spawned from AA. Why? Do we need to add some people or make changes?

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Pro Empowerment - Engage & Enable


November 27, 2012 at 10:53 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Starmom
Member
Posts: 319

Oh no, everything is a-o-k here...   I was just looking at this (c/p from wiki):  On September 14, 1953, AA authorized NA the use of AA's 12 steps and traditions on the condition that they stopped using the AA name, causing the organization to call itself Narcotics Anonymous.

So I was wondering if that could be taken to mean AA should bear some degree of responsibility for NA



November 27, 2012 at 10:57 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Live_free_or_die
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Posts: 849

Huh. Interesting question. I think AA has responsiblity to a large degree for NA. However, how are we defining responsibility?

 

If responsibility is defined as something of a morally or ethically standpoint then I would say yes. If we are talking from a legal standpoint then I would have to say no. Keep in mind I am not an attorney and this should not be considered legal advice.

 

On a side note, I have often wondered why we seem to focus mainly on AA and not NA more. Or the so called treatment centers here in the US for that matter.

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Pro Empowerment - Engage & Enable


November 27, 2012 at 11:07 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Clayton
Member
Posts: 64

My experience in NA is a lot less than in AA. That is maily because of the vibe I felt in there; it's weird and cult-like. You might agure that so is AA, but the AA meetings I always attended has some free-thinkers in them. Maybe, I'm being very subjective in thinking this but like I said, the atmosphere in NA meetings seems very cult-like, at least t me.


Sure, More info about NA provided in this website could not be a bad thing. It could only help get the word out about the failure of 12-Step programs, and the real dangers they present to society.

--

The sobering truth about Alcoholics Anonymous http://www.orange-papers.org/

November 28, 2012 at 4:48 AM Flag Quote & Reply

SallyJ
Member
Posts: 435

You Go Rainbow!  

 

I believe we can add the names of the Alcoholics Anonymous Board of Trustees.  When people donate to AA the money goes straight to the top to pay their salaries, benefits, and retirement funds. 

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Pro Empowerment!

November 28, 2012 at 6:21 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Live_free_or_die
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Posts: 849

OK, I am going to make this a page at the top of the website. We can add names to the AA Wall of Shame as the names are nominated.

 

The intent of the AA Wall of Shame is to list "persons" of AA interest, and eventually have a little blurb about why they are on the Wall.

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Pro Empowerment - Engage & Enable


November 29, 2012 at 10:25 PM Flag Quote & Reply

SallyJ
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Posts: 435

Henrietta Seiberling (or is it Sieberling?)

Tom Powers

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Pro Empowerment!

November 30, 2012 at 9:00 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Live_free_or_die
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Jeezuzz mother christ almighty billyw!! How could I miss Henrietta Seiberling?

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Pro Empowerment - Engage & Enable


November 30, 2012 at 7:34 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Live_free_or_die
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A young Henrietta Buckler Seiberling - Henrietta was instrumental in founding AA

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November 30, 2012 at 7:47 PM Flag Quote & Reply

seagal007
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Posts: 186

I could see this wall growindg real large and put in sections. Founders, Treatment centers that are nothing but AA promotors,Judges that mandate AA, Psychologist and psychiatrists that push AA for clients that have addiction problems. Names and stories

November 30, 2012 at 7:58 PM Flag Quote & Reply

bitter
Member
Posts: 335

Just read a piece on Seiberling & her involvement in AA, now I am firmly convinced that AA/NA is a religion!!!

November 30, 2012 at 8:02 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Live_free_or_die
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seagal007 at November 30, 2012 at 7:58 PM

I could see this wall growindg real large and put in sections. Founders, Treatment centers that are nothing but AA promotors,Judges that mandate AA, Psychologist and psychiatrists that push AA for clients that have addiction problems. Names and stories

@007 - You would be correct about the largeness. You always have good ideas. Mind if I pull a Bill W. and steal em? : )

 

@bitter - You would also be correct. Yep, the Akron Group early members were mostly all Oxford Groupers, and quite religious. In fact, I am of the opinion that Akron AA was more instrumental in founding AA than they have been given credit for at this point.

 

I think we should incorporate NA also, in addition to treatment centers, judges, etc. The whole shooting match.

--

Pro Empowerment - Engage & Enable


November 30, 2012 at 8:17 PM Flag Quote & Reply

seagal007
Member
Posts: 186

Live_Free Ya cant steal anything I post ,Im delighted when anything I put here can be useful. I think Na is just an extension os AA and should be included. Anybody that does a little research can see that the oxford group it the root of AA

November 30, 2012 at 8:31 PM Flag Quote & Reply

CritiCoolThinking
Member
Posts: 203

don't forget "door knob"

December 1, 2012 at 12:35 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Live_free_or_die
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Posts: 849

Is this the correct door knob ?

 

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Pro Empowerment - Engage & Enable


December 15, 2012 at 10:21 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Clayton
Member
Posts: 64

That photo of Henrietta Buckler Seiberling speaks: "I am going to control the fuck out of for my Christian God!"

I have seen that fanatical facial expression before in many a church basement.

--

The sobering truth about Alcoholics Anonymous http://www.orange-papers.org/

December 16, 2012 at 8:55 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Live_free_or_die
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Posts: 849

Although I am an atheist, I do not preach my religion on anyone, & I expect the same from others. People should be allowed to believe in what they want.

 

Thanks to Bill W. & Dr. Bob there is a new (1935) religion based upon some wacky concepts that are still today (almost 2013) preached in church basements and other rooms around the world.

 

Henrietta Seiberling was the women that introduced Bill W. to Dr. Bob. Henrietta was a member of the Oxford Group, a devout christian group that was itself also a religious cult. Henrietta had a falling out with Bill W. due to Bill W.'s character defects and vileness.

 

AA was introduced by Bill W. as his creation, although research has shown that everything in the AA scriptures and the 12 steps was "borrowed" from the Oxford Group and other previous religious concepts and writings, including the Bible.

 

Bill W. spawned The General Service Board of Alcoholics Anonymous, Inc., Alcoholics Anonymous World Services, Inc. and Alcoholics Anonymous Grapevine, Inc. to carry his new religious message. These entities are all recognized by the IRS as 501(c)(3) tax-exempt corporations that do not pay any income taxes. In addition, due to their incorporation as NY nonprofit entities these corporations also enjoy numerous local tax exemptions (sales taxes, real estate and personal property taxes).

 

Bill W. and his cronies from day 1 espoused and preached that excessive drinking was a disease (a concept put forth by Dr. Silkworth and others). Bill W. et al latched onto this concept and preached that this "disease" was also incurable and lifelong. This all to influence and promote the Big Book of AA and the 12 steps.

 

Marty Mann was an early AA member. Marty joined AA in 1939 after having been institutionalized for her drinking habits for something like 2 years. Due to slow Big Book sales and the slow growth off AA in 1939 and the early 1940's a plan was hatched in NY by Bill W. et al to "get the word out" about AA and the "disease".

 

In 1944, Marty Mann left AA to establish a new organization (National Committee for Education on Alcoholism) that had as its sole purpose the promotion of the "disease" concept of "alcoholism". There is no doubt in my mind that this new organization was not the brainchild of Bill W. et al to promote and grow the AA religion. The offices of this new organization were established at Yale University, where Marty Mann was able to recruit E. M. Jellinek.

 

E. M. Jellinek is the man that is responsible for the now famous Jellinek Curve. The results of the study that was performed by Mr. Jellinek, at the behest of Marty Mann, were suspect in that the study was comissioned for but one purpose, that being to further solidify the "disease" concept of "alcoholism" and add some weight to the flawed results by virtue of the alleged scientific credentials of Jellinek and the use of the University's name. In the years subsequent to Jellineks study his academic credentials were called into question and Jellinek himself distanced himself from the study and downplayed the results. It remains a mystery to this day how much Jellinek gained both financially and professionally by prostituting himself to the desired outcomes that AA, Bill W. and Marty Mann insisted upon.

 

And to this day, 12/16/2012, we are still dealing with the fallout and repercussions that these people have had, and continue to have, in the lives of countless millions seeking help with substance misuse.

 

A bogus religious movement that causes more harm than good, a bogus step program that has as its purpose the conversion of individuals to a religious cult bent on controlling the lives of its members.

 

And in the course of time, in order to get rich and further along the AA "movement", the Hazelden Foundation was created in Minnesota in 1949 by some enterprising AA members. The Hazelden Foundation is another nonprofit corporation that enjoys IRS tax-exempt stautus a swel as state & local tax exemptions.

 

Shame on these persons. And most of all, the Shaman of the Sham that continues to Shame, Bill W.

--

Pro Empowerment - Engage & Enable


December 16, 2012 at 11:58 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Starmom
Member
Posts: 319

I was going to mention this when this subject first came up, and probably should have- while it may seem like a good idea (the wall), putting names on it does leave people open to a bunch of b.s.     The Truth is not 'slander'- but publicly posting individual names could lead to more trouble than it's worth.  

January 16, 2013 at 11:13 AM Flag Quote & Reply

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